New Buggy Whip

[BearsFan]

Furled leaders are for tourists, even in trout country.

50lb butt section is too stiff for for an 8wt because it is stiffer than the fly line causing twists in the line not turn over.

There are a handfull of knots better than the surgeons, it is acceptable if you are 8yrs old or younger.

I wish you the best in finding a hot chick who kayaks, there definitely are a few around. If she has a hot friend let me know.

That is all.

[bk]

There are a handfull of knots better than the surgeons, it is acceptable if you are 8yrs old or younger.

bearsfan, since i am new to tying my own leaders, what would you recommend other than the surgeons knot?

thank you.

btw, i'm 9 yrs old.

[tlhflyfisher]

I'm back in Minnesota tonight and checked in to find this little discussion on leaders and knots. At the risk of beating a dead horse, I will offer my two cents. For those that have access to fly shops a tapered leader designed for saltwater takes all of the guess work away. Absent that, a straight 6 to 9 feet of thirty pound line will turn over most big flies just fine.

Regarding knots, I use a rapala or uni-knot to create a loop connection to the fly line. I find the perfection loop to be a weak alternative for that purpose. For tying tippet to leader, a blood knot or double surgeons knot are strong connections for heavy tippet and saltwater fish. The surgeon's knot is a good knot for freshwater connections (trout and bass). It will work in the salt but I have found the other two to be stronger. If you must tie two pieces of line together with radically different diameters, a albright knot works pretty well. I often use and albright knot to tie the fly line and backing together.

[bk]

thanks Bruce. I'll give those knots a shot. hurry up and get back down here, things are picking up lately.

[sosprey]

Here's another knot for large diameter differences - I posted it in a different thread re: rod selection that had digressed into line choices. It was originally recommended for braid to flouro connections but is so similar to the surgeons I'm thinking about using it for butt to leader connections -

For now I'm trying perfection loops but they seem bulky.

[Shorewalker]

OK, I will show my ignorance but I was thinking about whipping / epoxy a loop in the ends of the leader. Is this just not worth the time or am I missing something else?

I have seen this suggestion from a couple of sources including one Mr. Kreh.

SW

[shutupandstrip]

SW,

That 7wt will be sweet. I have the 5wt in that and love it. I would recommend a line a bit heavier than AFTMA standards....which is around 185 grains, this is if you're heading out to the salt. Bonefish line tapers are typically lighter than Redfish tapers....so I'd recommend SA Redfish or Rio's Redfish line. AFTMA measures the weight of the first 30ft of fly line. I personally have a Sage Xi3 and I'm running a Rio Redfish line that is in all honesty a 9 wt. bonefish line. The heavier line will turn over larger flies in the wind better, but if you go too heavy, the rod will break down and it won't perform it's best. (You'll see tailing loops.) I would also recommend snipping off the first 15-18 inches of tapered leader, and attaching a similar weight piece of fluoro using a surgeon knot. It's been the cheapest way for me. Hope this helps.

And I think BK meant 50%....not 50lb.

[tlhflyfisher]

BK, I am back on Monday and eager to get on the water.

Regarding epoxyed loops, I would always defer to Lefty Kreh,
but he may mean the epoxyed loop for the end of the fly line itself. I have heard of using epoxy to strengthen a nail knot but never heard of using it on both ends of the leader.

[shutupandstrip]

The loop to loop is the way to go....regardless of how you tie it. Most fly lines today already come with a welded loop at the end...and a lot of leaders are already tied as well. I use a perfection and haven't lost a red yet. It's also easy to change leaders over if I want to use a sinking leader for trout.

[bk]

good to have you back, dusty. lets fly the salt sometime soon.

[Shorewalker]

The Kreh reference suggested whipping a loop in the end in place with a tying bobbin and A thread plus a little epoxy / hard as nails in the middle and to finish.
SW

[shutupandstrip]

That's the way I do it. It's amazing what that loop will hold like that. I slide the fly line in a vise and use a rubber band through the loop and hook it to the bobbin holder. Unless you have three hands, that's about the easiest way I've found to do it. I haven't tied a nail knot in at least 4 years. Good to see a few more guys trying the fly.

[bk]

just tied a mini crease fly for freshwater. pretty simple actually.

[shutupandstrip]

Very niiice, how much?

[BearsFan]

Nice lookin' fly bk.

Look into the blood knot for leader tying, uni to uni will work too but I feel that the tag ends on the uni (which run parallel to the leader) pick up more grass. The tag ends on a blood knot are perpendicular to the leader. Blood knot is also faster/easier to tie, with practice you can do it in 10 seconds in the dark (literally). I am a fan of the perfection loop. It is definitely not weak, I use it on my tarpon leaders. Also try making your leaders entirely out of fluorocarbon or hard mono, they will tie better and cast better.